Django's daughter ? song title

murrayatuptowngaller · April 27

If she looked 23 instead of 32 or 22 instead of 42, we can blame it on our own age :O)

Interesting story. Maybe, as Stephane Grapelli said, 'he didn't own a watch', maybe Ms. Jayat didn't own a watch or calendar.

ChrisMartin · April 27

https://www.djangobooks.com/forum/discussion/comment/121142#Comment_121142

Indeed David was still young, although within the context of this discussion 15 may be considered adult enough in the gypsy community. But that is why I suggested "contact David (Reinhardt) to ask if he remembers his father ever mentioning Sandra." rather than ask him for his own memories. It is often mentioned how a lot of the gypsies we read about, those related to Django and those who pass on the musical tradition, form part of a close community, and it is probable that David would have heard of or known something of Sandra who was an aunt after all.

lucky · April 27

Ah, a bit older than I thought (still too young to lose a father of course).

TonyRees · April 27

I have taken the liberty of assembling all the images I have of the (young) Sandra into a montage, below, with alternative ages based on the suggested "younger" vs "older" dates of birth, respectively (i.e. c.1939 vs 1930). Let me know which you would pick as the more likely... Regards, Tony

lucky · April 28

Thanks Tony - she was certainly a striking woman and those high cheekbones would have kept her looking young her whole life. It's a shame we don't have any later pictures, I guess she must have disappeared from the scene after 1972, yet still well-known enough for her death to be noticed?

I still tend towards the older look - I think she looks quite assured and grown up, particularly in the 1972 pictures. It's really hard to tell from photos though, there's a ten year gap covered here and she looks pretty much the same in all of them. Make-up, hair dye, lighting and a good photographer will all be working to conceal ageing,

lucky · April 28

I've found a couple of dateable photos from later in her life:

toni-gatlif-sandra-jayat-association-innitiative-tsigane1.jpg

This appears to be from 1984 so either 54 or 45.

This is from a book published in 1992 so either 62 or 53.

sandra-jayat-lappel-du-voyage-exposition-decembre-1992.jpg

Another from 1992

billyshakes · April 28

To further cloud the situation, here's a bio that states 1940 as her year of birth.

https://www.theromanielders.org/elders/2/12/

lucky · April 28

Tony, I've done a little digging myself.

First of all, I've tracked down the 'interview' with Daphne Maurice which is the main source for Begoña Barrera's article. It's not really an interview, more a memory of a chat with her at a bookshop in 1972 - Maurice's describes her as 'young' in 1972 (although she must have been at least 32 by that point) and to add to the confusion, says she was 19 in 1962 when she published her first poetry, which would put her birthday in either 1941 or 42. I've sent this to you as a PDF.

However ... drum roll ... I've discovered that the 1962 poems were originally published in 1959 in a journal called Europe - I'll send this to you as well. She would have been 19 in 1959 (until she turned 20) and it's possible that the 1940 date just comes from someone assuming someone who was 19 in 1959 was born in 1940. This would also explain why she told Maurice the poems were published when she was 19.

So 1939 is looking like the most plausible date so far, unless the death notice has access to her birth certificate.

TonyRees · April 28

Thanks very much Lucky.

Maybe I should put up photos of myself from different years and we can have fun guessing my age in each (only joking!). However it does make the point though...

Tony

ChrisMartin · April 28

As an aside that adds no further evidence to her exact age I have a few first day covers issued by the French post in a series named Les Gens du Voyage which featured Sandra's art in 1992 ( I think there was another in 2002 also ) and one of the paintings illustrated was not identified or titled like the others so I did a Google search. I found a reference to that particular artwork in an auction catalogue from a year ago when a signed lithograph of her painting 'Solitude' was sold by the well-known and respected auction company Drouot which lists her as born in 1939. Not a cast-iron piece of evidence but one would expect their researchers would have access to some research possibly.

Anyway, when I have time to dig them out I will scan better images.