PIEZO OPTIONS schatten vs k&k?

jimbo78

Hi all,

I've been trawling around here for a week or so trying to gather information on the k&k maccaferri or schatten hfn-s2. On the face of it, two passive piezo systems, mounted on the inside of the guitar.
I've had nice results with piezos stuck on the outside (through preamp/buffer/eq), but I'm sick of the hassle of putting them on and taping up the wiring etc. Not interested in a bigtone at this stage.

SCHATTEN HFN-S2
So, some say schatten suck the acoustic volume/tone. True? Yet many people seem to have them installed. Any users out there with first hand wisdom?

K&K PURE MACCAFERRI
There are a few threads where users rave about just how good the K&K system is. Has anyone tried both? Do they also 'rob' some of the acoustic tone/volume?

I'm happy to go with a passive system and run it through a Baggs para-DI plus or similar. Any thoughts on that combination? I'm usually playing into a PA in a noisy restaurant, sometimes a small amp. I also do a fair bit of unplugged playing, that's why I'm concerned about losing volume.

I guess a Stimer-type pick-up is also an option, but I'm not keen on changing to electric strings to optimize for a magnetic pick-up. If the restaurants I played in weren't so crowded and noisy, I'd use my pro70 mic, but at the volumes we need, it just feeds back too much.

klaatu

I've recently abandoned pickups and gone with just my AT831b mike (similar to the Pro 70) mounted with an AT8468 Guitar/Violin Mount and running through a Headway EDB1 preamp. The EDB1 has all sorts of capabilities in terms of EQ and notch filters, so with the right tweaking, I've been able to eliminate feedback. The other guys in the band tell me that this setup is putting out the most realistic acoustic sound of any that I have tried. I've used this successfully with a PA and also with my Schertler David amp (although you have to be very careful about amp placement with a mike). For concert situations, where people are actually sitting and listening, I prefer miking the guitar (SM57 or similar).

I did have Schattens in a couple of previous guitars, and the sound was pretty good, less hot than a Bigtone and not as edgy as a lot of piezos tend to be. Some people say that because it mounts on the bridge braces, it has to reduce acoustic sound. I didn't really notice any dramatic change after the pickup was installed, but maybe my ears weren't that sensitive.

jimbo78

Update:

I ordered the schatten hfn-s2 and ultrasound DI plus. Installed pick-up, and plugged in. Initially itwas disappointing....nasally...to much mid...muddy lows...and a real lack of 'sparkly' highs...

So I tried plugging into my Barcus Berry clone--very nice! Problem being, of course, that I bought the DI for all of its functions...XLR balanced out, line out, parallel out, FX loop, notch, phase switch....

But hold on! hadn't I just described the sound of an UNbuffered piezo? Why is Schatten calling the DI Plus a perfect match for their pickups when it has an input impedance of only 1Mohm? Isn't that on the low side for a passive piezo?

Easily to find out...popped the hood, desoldered (trickier than I thought!) the 1M resistor and popped in a 10M resistor.

Success! I now have the tone of my Barcus Berry 3000a clone with a decent bunch of features and plenty of headroom.

I keep plugging it back in, checking it's not just a pschyological effect, but I'm pretty damn sure it sounds heaps better, much clearer, less nasal, warm deep bass. I've read a fair bit about buffering piezos, and the general trend is they like to 'see' a high impedance input, with 3-10Mohms not uncommon options. Perhaps an electronics guru could step in and put me right/explain further.

By the way, I have no idea if changing the input resistor will affect the rest of the circuit, or if I should have made other changes to accomodate my mod, but for now I'm happy. Will post an update if anything goes up in smoke at my next gig!