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Chordal Question Revolving Middle Finger Double-Stop

Stamos666Stamos666 New
edited February 2010 in Gypsy Rhythm Posts: 24
For the chord A Major 6/9, the 'chart' looks like this

7
7
6
7
7
5

It says play the '7th fret' on the A and D string with your middle finger and the 6th fret with your index finger...however how can you position your middle finger doublestop so it doesn't mute the 6th fret G string?? It's almost impossible for me. It's the same case with E9 and other chords where you use a middle finger doublestop and there is another note under it that cannot be barred.

Comments

  • MichaelHorowitzMichaelHorowitz SeattleAdministrator
    Posts: 5,813
    It just takes practice....make sure you don't barre it....just place the tip of your finger down in-between the the two strings. It's a little weird at first but becomes natural with practice.

    'm
  • If you have small fingers and a wide neck it may not be possible to do it cleanly without some angle on your finger.

    AS MH says, practice ... if it was really easy we could all play like Stochelo
    The Magic really starts to happen when you can play it with your eyes closed
  • JazzDawgJazzDawg New
    Posts: 264
    I always look for alternatives in voicings. I have smallish hands too, and play a D-500, with a neck width of 1 7/8" at the nut. While I can finger these chords, I've been playing for some 30 odd years. I don't really like using my thumb as it hurts my wrist after a bit. In this case, you could try this fingering. For me, using the pinky is easier to do with this voicing, though I find myself varying the voicing depending on what I want to hear.

    5th
    Fret
    1 !-------!-------!---4---!-------!
    2 !-------!-------!---4---!-------!
    3 !-------!---1--!--------!-------!
    4 !-------!-------!---3---!-------!
    5 !-------!-------!---2---!-------!
    6 !---T--!-------!--------!-------!

    [i]Alternate - No 6th String Root and Leaving out the 5th[/i]
    1 !-------!-------!---4---!-------!
    2 !-------!-------!---4---!-------!
    3 !-------!---1--!--------!-------!
    4 !-------!-------!---3---!-------!
    5 !-------!-------!--------!-------!
    6 !------!-------!---------!-------!


    This voicing is more difficult on frets 1 through 7, and you can alway leave out the root note on the 6th string. You have alternatives, and they really don't give up a lot. The basic thing to know is what notes give a chord it's flavor. For the Maj 6/9, it's the 3rd, 6th, and 9th are the most important tones. So for the A Major, the tones

    Root - A, 3rd - C#, 5th - E, 6th - F#, B - 9th.

    If you play with others, you could even work out chord shapes that leave out some tones, and the other player uses a voicing to pick them up. Lots of recording groups make use of this idea. For example, you could have 1 guitar, play the Alternate Voicing leaving out the Root on the sixth string and 5th, and have another guitar play only those notes. In practice, the way it's done is usually playing a the same chord on different frets of the guitar. For A Maj 6/9, one would play a voicing on the 7th fret and another on the say the 2nd fret. These are just examples, I find it fun to explore my choices, and pick what sounds best.

    [i]Alternate -2 Guitars - Same Chord - Different Voice[/i]
    1st Guitar - 2nd Fret
    1 !-------!---1---!-------!-------! F# (6th)
    2 !-------!---1---!-------!-------! C# (3rd)
    3 !-------!-------!--------!---4--! B (9th)
    4 !-------!---1--!--------!-------! E ( 5th)
    5 !-------!-------!--------!---3--! C# (3rd)
    6 !------!-------!---------!------! muted

    2nd Guitar - 7th Fret
    1 !---1--!-------!-------!------! B (9th)
    2 !---1--!-------|-------|------! F#(6th)
    3 !------!-------!---3---|------! E(5th)
    4 !---1--!-------|-------|------| A (Root)
    5 !------|-------|-------|------| open or muted
    6 !------|-------|-------|------| muted

    If you have a bass player they will most probably play the root, anyway. In group setting with more than 1 rhythm player, I find it the sound gets really muddy and confusing if everyone is playing the same full chord. I like space in the accompaniment to give the soloist room, and the music sounds richer in my opinion.

    I don't have any first hand knowledge of how a group of real gypsy players approach it, but I've recorded acoustic rhythm tracks using that approach and it really makes a full rich sound. Might not exactly be 'gypsy style', but it sounds nice to me.

    Yes, do attempt to stretch and learn how to make your fingers make that chord using that first joint, but the truth is - you need to approach it with some caution and not hurt yourself trying to play them. Just my opinion, but it works for me.
  • Try this easy alternative.

    second finger 6string 5th fret
    first finger barre strings 5,4,3 on the 4th fret
    third finger 2 string 5th fret

    you can double the root on the 1st string with the pinky is you desire. Nice full chord almost straight up except that the fifth is an octave up. You can do a first inversion voicing (except for the problematic 5th0 by not playing the 6th string and playing the first string.
    The Magic really starts to happen when you can play it with your eyes closed
  • klaatuklaatu Nova ScotiaProdigy Rodrigo Shopis D'Artagnan, 1950s Jacques Castelluccia
    Posts: 1,645
    Here's another version of that:
    2nd finger 6th string 5th fret
    2nd finger mutes 5th string
    1st finger barre strings 4,3 on the 4th fret
    3rd finger 2nd string 5th fret
    4th finger 1st string 5th fret

    The beauty of this is that it can be either an A6/9 (root on the 6th string) or a D6/9 (no root). All of these notes appear in either chord.
    Benny

    "It's a great feeling to be dealing with material which is better than yourself, that you know you can never live up to."
    -- Orson Welles
  • kimmokimmo Helsinki, Finland✭✭✭✭
    Posts: 158
    Stamos666 wrote:
    For the chord A Major 6/9, the 'chart' looks like this

    7
    7
    6
    7
    7
    5

    It says play the '7th fret' on the A and D string with your middle finger and the 6th fret with your index finger...however how can you position your middle finger doublestop so it doesn't mute the 6th fret G string?? It's almost impossible for me. It's the same case with E9 and other chords where you use a middle finger doublestop and there is another note under it that cannot be barred.

    It's not that often that you really need to make ALL strings ring cleanly when playing pompe. In your A Major 6/9 example there are tones that are not absolutely vital, like the octave on D-string. If you have problems with the middle finger double stop then I'd suggest you let your middle finger damp the redundant tonic (until you find the correct position for the double stop):

    (7)
    7
    6
    X
    7
    5

    I doubt anyone will notice the difference - at least for the worse.
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