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rhythm accent

JackJack western Massachusetts✭✭✭✭
edited March 2005 in Technique Posts: 1,911
Hi, all.

I'm hoping someone can help me figure out how to notate a particular accent that's common in the style. It's that whip-fast upstroke people sometimes throw in right before a chord change, or at the end of a bar. A good example of it shows up in the video section of the Alors?...Voila! disc, in the Apres L'effort section. Mine is definitely off-there's too much open space-but I can't for the life of me figure out where the trouble is (releasing the left hand too soon, wrong pick stroke, etc.). Any help's appreciated.

Best,
Jack.
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Comments

  • nwilkinsnwilkins New
    Posts: 431
    Jack - it involves a whip like movement of the wrist starting with a short downstroke that is quickly whipped upwards. Hard to explain but I think that might help - it is not just an upstroke.
  • JackJack western Massachusetts✭✭✭✭
    Posts: 1,911
    nwilkins wrote:
    Jack - it involves a whip like movement of the wrist starting with a short downstroke that is quickly whipped upwards. Hard to explain but I think that might help - it is not just an upstroke.

    I've definitely got both parts; the trouble, I think, is more in how I'm breaking up the beat, and the duration I'm giving each part of the stroke. Part of me expects the upstroke to fall on the 'and' of the four (...four and), but it's more subtle than that, I think. On top of that, part of me thinks I've heard it on the 'and' of three, followed by a rest on the four, followed by '...and one' (something like: One |Two |Three and|....and|One...etc|). Hope that's not too confusing.

    Wait...I'm just about to post this, but one last thing pops to mind-is it both down and up on the 'and' of four that you mean? I've been counting the downstroke on four as the downstroke of the accent; maybe the 'short downstroke' you mentioned is after that, giving me something like this:

    Four................And
    down...............down/up
    Maybe? That would explain why I think I'm hearing too much space.

    Thanks,
    Jack.
  • nwilkinsnwilkins New
    Posts: 431
    Jack,

    yes, the down and up occupy the "and" space - the downstroke of the beat is different than the small downstroke of the accent. So you end up playing two consecutive downstrokes (although the second is very short and blends into the upstroke).
  • JackJack western Massachusetts✭✭✭✭
    Posts: 1,911
  • phil_gphil_g UKNew
    Posts: 28
    Hi Jack, I saw the Paul Mehling DVD & he likened it to trying to put out a match with a flick of the hand. I found that helped - it's the same movement & it helps the wrist to stay relaxed. Cheers :)
  • Posts: 101
    hi Jack, as you play try counting out the beat as:

    1-e-and-a-2-e-and-a-3-e-and-a-4-e-and-a

    I learned to do that when studying west African polyrhythmic music, it opens your ears up a lot!

    Carter
  • Josh HeggJosh Hegg Tacoma, WAModerator
    Posts: 622
    And... make sure you swing your count. Like a snare drum played with brushes. If you count and play it straight you get a blue grass sound- Very linear. When you hear good rhythm players it has a swing not a box feel - for lack of abetter term.

    Shhh-tt-Shhh-tt Shhh-tt Man it is hard to type a sound! :)

    Cheers
  • djangologydjangology Portland, OregonModerator Dell Arte Hommage
    Posts: 887
    uh... thats a tough one. nobody, especially people just learning this stuff, should expect to figure this out easily. you should tackle things one at a time. practice your basic flat-4 and swing rhythms, master the la pompe and when you do this then the other accents will eventually come to you including some things that are unique to yourself.
    ---
    "I want to party like its 1939!"
  • Andre AgazziAndre Agazzi zürich / switzerland✭✭
    Posts: 2
    yes it's like a secret. Noboddy can explain it. I am looking for years but only hidden information on the net.
    looking for gypsy jazz playing people
  • If I were notating it I would put it as an ornamental with the value taken from the previous note. When I do it I am still coming down on I pretty much on top of the beat. It is definitely an anticipation.
    The Magic really starts to happen when you can play it with your eyes closed
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