Larger sound hole petite bouche models

opus20000

Some petite bouche models like Di Mauro Jazz 2 have a larger sound hole, are there other brand guitars of the type with that feature? Does it make it louder??

Joli Gadjo

I dont know about new guitars, but doesn't Bucolo has models featuring larger sound hole? I doubt it makes it louder, but it's certainly easier for you to hear yourself!

Barkonator

I know that the Mazaud Vieux Paris has a larger sound hole. Michael has one for sale right now. In his write up he says that it provides "improved bass response."

I am still learning how to make mine talk, but I love the tone. It was a real treat to hear some much more experienced players play it at Django in June this year. @MaximusVolumus is playing it in this video.

Craig Bumgarner

Right, the size of the sound hole doesn't seem to affect the volume of the audience hears. A larger sound hole, however, will seem louder with more bass to the player.

My opinion is the sound the player hears should be close to what the listener hears, so, too big or too small for that matter is not so good.

Somewhere in the middle seems a good compromise. I've been occasionally making my small oval sound holes, when I use one, 10mm longer and wider., but honestly, i don't hear a lot of difference compared to the size Selmer used. The Castellucia size D hole is a good compromise between a small oval and a big D.

Craig Bumgarner

And of course there is the issue of being able to get ones hand inside the guitar, something that is taken for granted on most other kinds of acoustic guitars. Luthiers are always talking about reaching inside and planing down a brace for this or that sound. Not possible with the standard Selmer petite bouche. I have at times asked someone with small hands to help.

Al Watsky

Getting inside the Petite Bouche guitars is a headache !
I end up using 2 piece clamps to allow placement of cleats.
Every trick in the book.
I own some older GJ guitars and noticed on one that JP Favino slightly enlarged the hole to allow access to the interior.
Just large enough for you to get your knuckles through the hole, still pretty narrow for the forearm though.
What a fuss. Its a tone port so the size is part of the sound model of the guitar.

Craig Bumgarner

Al Watsky wrote: »

Its a tone port so the size is part of the sound model of the guitar.

Right, the size of the hole is one of the factors determining the resonance of the air inside the body. The smaller the hole, the lower the resonance. Another factor is the volume of air, the more volume, the lower the resonance which is one reason large bodied instruments, like Favinos and those 18" Strombergs, have better bass response. A deeper body will do the same thing, like of some of those Mexican acoustic bass guitars with 7-8" deep sides.

So, one could increase the sound hole size a little and the body volume a little and have the same resulting air resonance, which should give the same sound signature. Course, when you change things around in a guitar, you sometimes get unexpected results. Guitars are complicated.

No doubt that little sound hole is a pain from a build/repair point of view. Increasing it 10mm in length and width makes it sufficient to get a hand inside, well my hand anyway. This raises the air resonance about 10Hz, not much.

Al Watsky

The older instruments would be in better condition now if they had had slightly larger sound holes then.
So much work going undone for lack of easy access.
An instrument that can be easily worked on stays healthy longer.

Craig Bumgarner

I checked my records, 3-5Hz is more accurate.

Craig Bumgarner

Also, keep in mind fingerboards that extend into the soundhole reduce the effective soundhole area and therefore lower the main air resonance of the body, for better or worse. On my Derecho model, the fingerboard extension lowers the main air about 5-6Hz which puts it about halfway between the same medium size D hole without the extension (107hz to 110hz) and the standard Selmer petite bouche (93-97hz).

pickitjohn

@Craig Bumgarner

Also, keep in mind fingerboards that extend into the soundhole reduce the effective soundhole area and therefore lower the main air resonance of the body, for better or worse. On my Derecho model, the fingerboard extension lowers the main air about 5-6Hz which puts it about halfway between the same medium size D hole without the extension (107hz to 110hz) and the standard Selmer petite bouche (93-97hz).

Has anyone tried to make a conversion plate to change a D hole to a Selmer Petite. Is that possible? Maybe have the best of Both World's

pick on

pickitjohn :peace: